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[heyvictor]

I prefer to eat meat that is cooked rare to the point of being almost raw but I do also prefer it to be hot. Cold raw meat just doesn't do it for me. I've eaten pieces of deer meat raw when I was butchering. Just not my thing.
By the way, filet mignon is actually made from one of the choicest and tenderest pieces on the animal.
My personal opinion (everyone has one) on aging meat is that it doesn't make it that much more tender, or change the flavor that much. What it does do, is make the meat easier for your body to digest and get the most out of it.

[bastish]

Living in Japan have the opportunity to eat lots of different raw meats beef (of course), horse, deer, bear, chicken, and once whale ( just to "try it".)

The important thing safety-wise when eating raw meat is less, I think if it is 100% "organic" and free range (though I whole heartedly think this is needed for sustainability reasons), but more the way the animal is slaughtered - namely, that it is kept clean.

I would not eat raw meat or eggs purchased from a supermarket unless it is labeled as being meant for raw consumption as "regular" meat may have fallen onto the floor or been cut with a blade that has touched feces or some other surface with harmful bacteria. 

Usually I get the beef from the cattle farmer down the road from me. He sends it away to a special slaughterhouse for high-end meat to make sure of this.  As for the wild meat - raw deer is amazing, especially the liver. Often when the hunters come back and are cleaning the catch, they cut up the liver right there on the spot and partake.

[Speqtuer]

The problem bastish is that first off the kind of foods that are being fed to a certain animal effect the fat and vitamin contents as well as hormone levels. When cattle are fed soy, which is a major feed component on most farms they are loaded with phytoestrogens. While this is not a big deal in very small amounts it is harmful in the long run. Not to mention soy is processed with nasties like benzene. Further more animals that are fed grains tend to be feed lot animals, IOW they spend most of their life in their own shit next to other diseased animals, which leads to the need for injected antibiotics and hormones to keep the animals "healthy". As if all that isn't bad enough those same conditions are completely inhumane, and we owe the animals we are going to eat a little better than that.

Also in regards to 'bad bacteria', the philosophy behind raw eating is that there really is not such thing. It is all just plain bacteria. This includes parasites and viruses as well. They are the bodies digesters and cleaners, and they only become dangerous when we try and wage all out (and hopeless) warfare on them, starving our bodies of these beneficial bugs and making ourselves susceptible to otherwise benign helpers.

The important point of raw eating is FAT, it is the most beneficial item our bodies can get, binding with toxins, heavy metals, etc and carrying them out of the body. The war Americans have made on fat is due, as usual, to faulty science, in this case it began in 1953 by one "Dr." Ancel Keys.

Here are a few articles on the claims I've made in this post:

Why grass fed free range animals:
http://www.eatwild.com/basics.html

Fat article on MSNBC
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22116724

There's a whole lot more that would probably turn everyone's world upside down and I don't think I'll say it all at once in the hopes of not coming off as a loon!

Ryan

[bastish]

Thanks for the links Speqtuer.  There was some new information in there, as well as some things I hadn't thought about for a while. I agree with you that if you are going to make raw (or cooked) beef  a major part of your diet you should be eating grass fed beef.  I was coming from the point of view of someone who rarely eats meat, or is just trying out raw meat.

For me, the health effects of eating my neighbors beef, which I know is fed corn (bad), as well as hay, are negligible compared to the environmental effects of finding 100% grass fed beef. I also know that while they are not free-range, they are not in huge feedlots and are handled with some degree of respect and consideration.  Because I do not rely on meat for my well being, I worry more about how the animal was treated  (and I know that a diet of corn or soy has negative effects on the animals health), and what negative effects it caused to the environment.

As for "bad" bacteria - I should have been more clear. I didn't mean to condemn the bacteria itself as "bad", in my view, it is just a creature in the world like you or me trying to do what it has evolved to do. I meant that people who want a pleasant experience from eating raw meant should be careful of  organisms that can make humans feel very uncomfortable - and such organisms do exist -  such as giardia (which I have experienced (though not from eating tainted meat), and parasites from raw river fish (which I have experienced) and just plain old "bad" clams (which I have experienced).  Again, my advice was meant for what I thought was someone whose *main* diet would not consist of raw meat, and would have little ability to build up resistance that humans surely once had.  The meat industry knows that people cook their meat, and they handle it carelessly as a result.

This is why I would never eat a hunk of raw ground beef from the supermarket.  I do however, if offered in a situation where it would be rude to refuse,  eat raw meat from the supermarket that was handled carefully with the expectation that people would be eating it raw.

I think your advice is completely applicable for anyone who intends to make meat a major component of their diet, be it raw *or* cooked. But if someone is not used to eating raw meat, I suggest not just getting a slab from the supermarket and digging in. Make sure you know the history - both what it was fed (if you will be eating a lot) and how carefully it was treated from the time it was killed to the time it reached your lips (especially if you only want to try it). 

[goatherd]

Awesome thread. Keep the info flowing.

Meanwhile.....I'm off to grab a leg of possum out of the fridge and give it a go 

I ate the liver, heart, kidneys, spleen and lungs for breakfast this morning....but cooked it all. Maybe next time I'll give some of it a go raw.

[Speqtuer]

This is why you want to get your meat from a local farmer that does not give antibiotics or hormones. Why you want them to be open to visits on the farm. Why you want them to feed organic, care about their animals, not be solely profit driven and also that they grass feed, free range.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VIjanhKqVC4

I don't agree with everything this video says, obviously, but I also don't want to take the chance of contributing to that kind of awful bullshit.
__________________________________________________________

I've talked a bit about the benefits of raw meat and other foods, now I'd like to turn to the harms of eating cooked meat/foods.

Lipid peroxides ^ Or Oxidized Lipids (fats). This refers to the oxidative degradation of lipids. It is the process whereby free radicals "steal" electrons from the lipids in cell membranes, resulting in cell damage. This process proceeds by a free radical chain reaction mechanism. It most often affects polyunsaturated fatty acids, because they contain multiple double bonds in between which lie methylene -CH2- groups that possess especially reactive hydrogens. As with any radical reaction the reaction consists of three major steps: initiation, propagation and termination.

If not terminated fast enough, there will be damage to the cell membrane, which consists mainly of lipids. Phototherapy may cause hemolysis by rupturing red blood cell cell membranes in this way[1]

In addition, end products of lipid peroxidation may be mutagenic and carcinogenic [2] . For instance, the end product malondialdehyde reacts with deoxyadenosine and deoxyguanosine in DNA, forming DNA adducts to them, primarily M1G. [2]

^ From: Wikipedia

The above basically means the fat, a once beneficial substance, has been ruined and turned in to something broken and harmful to the body. An example that Aajonus gives in his book "The Recipe for Living Without Disease" is "Cooked fats cannot exchange ions or molecules properly.. If the body forms, from cooked fats, an improper or incomplete lubricant (lubricating is one duty fat performs) to protect the arteries, the fat hardens (plaque) and arteries become brittle after many years, especially from heated vegetable oils."

Acrylamide -  Acrylamide is a chemical that is used to make polyacrylamide materials. Polyacrylamide is used in the treatment of drinking-water and waste water where it is used to remove particles and other impurities (see Question 15). It is also used to make glues, paper and cosmetics. Polyacrylamide materials contain very small amounts of acrylamide.

Acrylamide is also used in the construction of dam foundations and tunnels, and appears to be produced in some foods prepared at high temperatures.

Acrylamide is known to cause cancer in animals. Also, certain doses of acrylamide are toxic to the nervous system of both animals and humans.

In April 2002 the Swedish National Food Authority reported the presence of elevated levels of acrylamide in certain types of food processed at high temperatures. Since then, acrylamide has been found in a range of cooked and heat-processed foods in other countries, including The Netherlands, Norway, Switzerland, the United Kingdom and the United States.

Previous concerns about acrylamide were focused on workers using acrylamide in their jobs, and cigarette smoking.

^From: World Health Organization Website

Higher Risk Foods

    *  Potato Chips (Crisps)
    * French Fries
    * Crackers, Toast, Bread Crisps, Cookies
    * Boxed Breakfast Cereal
    * Corn Chips (Crisps)
    * Bakery Products
    * Coffee
    * Cocoa
    * Bread

Heterocyclic Amines (HCA's) - Some heterocyclic amines (HCAs) found in cooked meat are known carcinogens. Research has shown that cooking certain meats at high temperatures creates chemicals that are not present in uncooked meats. For example, heterocyclic amines are the carcinogenic chemicals formed from the cooking of muscle meats such as beef, pork, fowl, and fish. HCAs form when amino acids and creatine (a chemical found in muscles) react at high cooking temperatures. Researchers have identified 17 different HCAs resulting from the cooking of muscle meats that may pose human cancer risk.[2] NCI's Division of Cancer Epidemiology and Genetics found a link between individuals with stomach cancer and the consumption of cooked meat, and other studies for colorectal, pancreatic, and breast cancer is associated with high intakes of well-done, fried, or barbecued meats. Other sources of protein (milk, eggs, tofu, and organ meats such as liver) have very little or no HCA content naturally or when cooked.

^From: Wikipedia

It should be noted that boiling and steaming do not create, or create very little HCA's. They are a product of high heat chemical reactions in the food.

[anti_]

Woah thanks for that Ryan,

Thats some pretty alarming stuff to me, I can't wait to get out of the city center and be able to get ahold of some good wild foods >.<

[yon yonson]

hey guys. im doing raw paleo too. it's great. if you want to learn more, go here: http://www.rawpaleoforum.com/